Andrew Schulz's Evolving Positions on Saudi Arabia

There are a few modest surprises on the preliminary lineup for the forthcoming inaugural Riyadh Comedy Festival, like Bill Burr, who generally seems to have a moral compass these days, and Pete Davidson, whose father died in the terrorist attacks allegedly supported by the festival’s sponsors. One name that isn’t surprising at all is Andrew Schulz, a cynical mercenary who’s already made a great deal of money performing for packed arenas in the United Arab Emirates, another repressive dictatorship, even as he presents himself as a staunch advocate for civil liberties here in the US. Still, out of idle curiosity and as an excuse not to do more pressing work, I thought I might look up some of his past statements about Saudi Arabia. Here’s what I found.

“Who are we to say don't chop up their body inside a Turkish embassy?”

One of the first mentions I could find was a short video he published on Twitter in 2018 about the murder of Jamal Khashoggi, essentially joking that it should not come as a surprise that Saudi Arabia would butcher a dissident: 

Schulz: Question of the day. Why are we so surprised that Saudi Arabia killed this journalist that was talking shit? Did y'all not see Aladdin? Remember when they tried to chop Aladdin's head off in a fucking children's movie for stealing a baguette?

A few years later, Schulz and his Flagrant cohost donned traditional headdresses for an occasionally coherent segment in which they lambasted Saudi Arabia by pretending to expound on the importance of America’s relationship with the kingdom. Throughout the bit, they joked about Saudi Arabia’s involvement in 9/11, its conflict with Yemen, gas prices, and the Khashoggi murder: 

Schulz: I just want to say that I understand diplomatic relations between the United States and Saudi Arabia haven't been the greatest from—they've been a little tense for the last, I don't know, how long ago was 2001? September 11th. How long ago was it when two of our favorite buildings went down? That was fucked up. Right? And obviously they had a lot to do with it, but we gotta move on. Time heals all wounds. And it also heals buildings collapsing to the ground. Even Building Seven—what happened to that one? I don't know. The point I'm trying to say here is a lot—it's time that these countries come together. Why? Because we need what? We need alliances. We need friends. Everybody's gonna make it seem like this is about oil being like seven, $8 a gallon.

Singh: It had nothing to do with it.

Schulz: We live in the city.

Singh: Why would you be so presumptuous?

Schulz: You're presuming.

Singh: Don't presume.

Schulz: Don't presume. This is about two powerful nations coming together and forming alliances so we can all be safe.

Singh: Yes.

Schulz: We don't care about oil. I take Ubers—that's on the driver.

Singh: Oil—I didn't even know. Does Saudi Arabia even have oil?

Schulz: We don't know. We don't know. The point is people are gonna make it look like, oh my God, you guys are just kissing Saudi Arabia's ass. So OPEC starts digging up some more oil or however you get the—I don't even know where they get the oil.

Singh: I resent that accusation.

Schulz: Exactly. Why can't we just want friends?

Singh: Why can't I just like a culture? You know what I mean? Why can't I just like a country and be willing to overlook certain politics? Just in the name of friendship?

Schulz: Yo, real talk, mind your business. I keep telling Americans, if they want to bomb the fuck out of Yemen, let them bomb it.

Singh: So what?

Schulz: What's Yemen?

Singh: It's Yemen.

Schulz: What's Yemen?

Singh: I thought it was a food.

Schulz: Me too. I thought they owned all the bodegas in Brooklyn. They seem pretty cool.

Singh: Yeah, I like those guys.

Schulz: I like them too.

Singh: We don't need this tension—

Schulz: It's too much. I think that we need to work on diplomatic relations with Yemen as well. As long as Saudi Arabia is okay with that. If they're not, then whatever they want to do. That would be nice.

Singh: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Schulz: Let's try to calm things down in the region.. A hundred percent. What else is there? If you want to kill a journalist that talks some shit about you, who are we to say don't chop up their body inside a Turkish embassy? Who are we to say that?

Singh: You know what? That's nosy of us.

Schulz: It is nosy of us.

“Saudi Arabia exists because we allow them to exist”

The price of gas seems to have been a particularly animating concern for Schulz. One day after this episode released, he argued on his other podcast, Brilliant Idiots, that Saudi Arabia only exists because America allows it to exist, in order to provide us with oil:

Charlamagne tha God: [...] I know who I want to win.

Schulz: Who?

Charlamagne: America. Get these goddamn gas prices down, okay?

Schulz: That's the fucked up thing. If you think about it. Like, Saudi Arabia said that they're not gonna start—they're not gonna, what is it called? I don't know—it's not more drilling of gas. What is it called? Extracting more gas? They're not gonna pump more gas. I don't know what the term is, but basically gas.

Charlamagne: How do you make gas?

Schulz: You yank it out of the earth. Yeah. So basically Saudi Arabia said they see that the gas price are the highest they've ever been. It's $150 a barrel. And Saudi— increase production, thank you. So it's like, Saudi Arabia exists because we allow them to exist. Don't get it fucking twisted. You're there to give us fucking gas, bitch. You know what I mean? So if we say turn that shit on, if we say turn that fucking shit on—no, because that shit got me tight! It's like, we giving them fucking weapons, we giving 'em support. The only reason they exist is because we protect them so that they can exist.

And then we're out here going, yo, we might need you to, what is it called? What is it called again? Increase production of gas, because we're hurting over here. And the only reason that you haven't been invaded by every one of your fucking neighbors is because we make sure you're not invaded by every one of your fucking neighbors. And you're not gonna print any more gas? Or increase production? That shit got me tight.

“They have a history of crashing things after hijacking them”

Back on Flagrant the following month, in a monologue promoting Elon Musk’s bid to buy Twitter—this was back when he basically did a spoken-word piece at the top of each episode—Schulz called the Saudi ruling class goatfuckers who oppress women and did 9/11: 

Schulz: Elon Musk, the richest man in the world and our favorite lesbian stepdad needs to run Twitter and not the Saudi royal family. And here's why. First of all, Elon is the GOAT, which is clearly why the Saudis are trying to fuck him. I mean, do we really want Weekend at Burning Yemen calling the shots at Twitter? This Saudi prince that looks like Wario just sniffed a little girl's bicycle seat rejected Elon's offer to buy Twitter. He said Elon's offer, which was 38% above the stock price, was too little. What? This guy must be dropping acid—and I'm not talking about on women trying to drive. Also, of course, Saudi Arabia doesn't want Elon owning it, okay? They're furious at him. Self-driving is a loophole to put women behind the wheel. We cannot let the Saudis control Twitter, okay? It won't last. They have a history of crashing things after hijacking them. Now we need Elon to buy Twitter. Okay? It's something we can all agree with. A rich South African is trying to own something that's not a person—that is progress. 

“All these things are like marketing”

In October 2023, Schulz performed a sold-out show at Etihad Arena in Abu Dhabi. (He would return to the venue several times; based on my past reporting, I'd conservatively estimate that he's made several hundred grand from these shows.) One month later, on Flagrant, he argued that Saudi Arabia should follow the United Arab Emirates’ lead in becoming a cultural destination for Western tourists:

Schulz: I think this is the reason why the Arab nations have not have not applied any pressure, or seemingly any pressure, towards Israel in the conflict right now. They will put out this forward-facing support for the Palestinian people, but they ain’t ready to bang. And I think it’s because they’re like, listen, we do not want terrorism in this region. We want investment. We want people coming here for vacations. We don't want this area to be synonymous with danger, murder, and killing. We want this shit settled. So Israel—on the low, I think they're basically like: “Israel, go in there, get fucking Hamas out of there, handle all that shit right here.” So this thing can be squashed and everybody can kind of pour in with the dollars.

Because I think they tasted it. They tasted what it's like when you're the belle of the ball. And in Europe people are going down to the Emirates, they're going down—now Saudi with these fucking events is looking incredible. There's all these new fights that are already scheduled. You have F1 races. They're like, “listen, we can't be thought of as this disgusting terror area of the world. And that will happen if there's ongoing conflict. Handle it.” And If they backed Palestine, this is gonna go on forever. So I think they're basically going, “Hey, how quickly can we knock this shit out? Because we want to get back to business.” 

Mark Gagnon: We gotta get Steve Harvey over here immediately. Steve Harvey loves that. And if it's good enough for Steve Harvey, it's good enough for me. 

Schulz: And you know who doesn't care about that? Iran. And you know who's not going to Iran? Americans ain't going to Iran. I don't know how many Europeans are going Iran, I don't know. But they're the ones who don't benefit from that tourism. Don't benefit from the Western dollars. Not even just Western dollars, shit, Eastern dollars. Everybody going there for vacation, et cetera. They have no benefit. So they're like, oh yeah, let's fuck this up. Y'all against us? Let's keep fucking it up. Maybe even Russia comes in as well. But the other countries there who have tasted the limelight, tasted the enjoyment, tasted that capitalism. I think they're like, “Hey, shut this down as quick as possible. Let's get back to business as usual.”

Singh: I think long-term they [Saudi Arabia] see the ability, the potential to become a superpower on a global stage. Like, we're a force. We got the money, we got people that'll do it. You know what I mean?

Schulz: I don't know if they have the numbers to be superpower, but I think that they could be an economic destination and a cultural destination and a place, and a hub for entertainment, vacation, business and culture. And it's like that can't happen if people are scared to come here because they're worried that they’re gonna get a fucking bomb explode in a mailbox and they're gonna die. Or they're worried that somebody's gonna chuck a rock at their wife for walking around in a skirt. So we need to make this shit feel very cool, calm and enjoyable for the west because they tasted the dollars of the west.

[…]

Media: I was just wondering how long can they continue operating this way just to get people—to change the vision in people’s minds where it’s like, “Oh, you know what, it is safe to go over”?

Schulz: Think about it like this. How much does, I dunno—who cares. Think about it like this. How much does Tesla pay in advertising and commercials? Zero. Elon is their advertiser. Maybe Saudi isn't putting out some crazy promotional campaign of “come to Saudi Arabia” and spending $10 million or $20 million across all these different, nine of those social media networks, TV studios, all this other shit. And maybe they've gone, “alright, instead of spending $50 million that way, why don't we just spend $50 million on the biggest fight? We'll pay double, but we'll have all the eyeballs on what Saudi Arabia is and we'll get maybe even more benefit because people are actually interested to come here and see what's going on.” So maybe they're overpaying, but at the same time, they might be paying the same amount than they would pay to advertise in a more traditional manner for people to come to their country.

[…]

This is what I think the tricky thing happens. When the places that have built up these tourism destinations that haven’t wrapped the tourism around culture, they’ve just wrapped it around, “Hey, look at this crazy building,” or “Hey, look at this fucking arcade,” or look whatever. Those can’t offer anything when a newer, fancier tourist destination comes out. Italy is not going anywhere. Greece is not going anywhere. Mexico is not going anywhere because, they offer thousands of years of history and culture. So if Saudi is smart, they'll look at the mistakes that have been made and the successes that have been made in the region and go, “Okay, this is what we have to avoid and this is what we have to lean into.” If I'm Saudi or if I'm any of them, I'm wrapping it around culture. Everything has to be culture, culture, culture. 

Media: They do that a little bit. They do it with the, "Hey, you can dress up, wear the headscarf, get pictures, be on a fucking camel and shit like that." But at the same time it's like, hey, women can't do this or you can't do that, or you're oppressed in this way. It's hard to really wrap it around the culture.

Schulz: You gotta get people addicted to the commerce. And once they've become accustomed to their new life, they do not want to sacrifice it. And then once they don't want to sacrifice it, they're willing to make the changes to continue this new life. And that is the game. So the first thing is get people addicted to the money and the success and driving the nice cars and eating at the fanciest restaurants and all your favorite athletes coming over. And then if they feel that dip even a little bit, you go, “well, people don't want to come here because women can't drive. They feel a little bit—“ Then they're like, “well, let these bitches drive. [It] Don’t affect my money. Let them drive.”

Gagnon: There's also maybe elements of the culture we don't even know about. What if they told you like, “Hey, we have pyramids in Saudi Arabia.” You'd be like, “I have no idea.” I have no idea what's over there. But this is an ancient country that has generations of culture that we might not know about because they haven't pushed the culture element. You know what I mean?

Like I said, he’s a mercenary. A few months later, in January 2023, he returned to this argument during a discussion of footballer Cristian Ronaldo’s move to Saudi Arabia to play in its football club. Once again, he glowingly characterized the kingdom’s efforts to paper over its human rights abuses by appealing to Western tourists:

Gagnon: How much value does a player like that bring?

Schulz: So here are the things. One, Saudi Arabia doesn't give a flying fuck about making money on any of these other endeavors. Okay? This is all marketing. "Come to Saudi Arabia, we're gonna run out of oil eventually. We need to prove to you that there's some shit here besides oil derricks and Mecca." Because I think the average person in the world just goes, "I think all Saudi Arabia has is oil derricks and Mecca." So, "oh, well we have a whole football league? I didn't even know Saudi Arabia had a football league.

So Saudi Arabia just built this hotel—Habitats or something like that. It's near Jordan, and part of Saudi Arabia, it's similar to Jordan, the geology looks just like Jordan, it's built within these crazy rock structures. And they just spent 10 times what another hotel, another Habitas hotel would ever spend. And it's simply just to draw tourists out there to prove that they have more than oil derricks and Mecca. [Cross-talk.] The Lion City, exactly, so all these things are like marketing. How can we become this global city and how can we shed a little bit of the reputation, the stigma that we already have, which is like, hey, women can't drive, everybody burka'd up to here, Khashoggi. So if the world is watching Saudi football games, not the world, but the Ronaldo fans are watching Saudi football fans [sic], maybe they want to go to Saudi to watch a football fan [sic]. Now there's an excuse. Now there's an excuse to travel a little bit. And people will go do that.

They're Ronaldo fans. Like, dude, if Michael Jordan was playing in another fucking country, you don't think that Michael Jordan fans would go there and watch a game? A hundred percent. So will they make back the $275 million, like dollar per dollar? I don't know. But is there—is an infinite amount of money that is returned from viewing Saudi Arabia as more than just those two things.

Singh: And all these oil-rich middle Eastern companies are now investing in other things. They know the oil's time is limited. So their money from all the oil is making money. Even when oil dries up, it's gonna be, whatever the word is, diversified into so many things. They're always gonna have infinite money. So I can pay 75 million. Who gives a fuck if it gives me good PR? 

Let us finally close out with an exchange from an episode of Brilliant Idiots in March of this year, when Schulz joked about Saudi Arabia’s criminalization of LGBT people: 

Schulz: [Singing] "I believe I could fly. I believe I could touch the sky."

Charlamagne: That wasn't Free Willy, that was fucking Space Jam.

Schulz: Yeah, but that could have worked.

Charlamagne: For Free Willy?

Schulz: Yeah.

Charlamagne: That song could work with anything. Goddamn.

Schulz: What else could it work—

Charlamagne: I've never been a huge R Kelly fan. I've always respected the talent.

Schulz: You know they play that for gays in Saudi Arabia. Before they—

Charlamagne: Shut the fuck up, man.

Schulz: Before they send them off the building, bro.

Charlamagne: Shut the fuck up.

Schulz: That's when they start playing it.

Charlamagne: Shut the fuck up.

Schulz: They come up to your apartment.

And there you have it—a man who believes in nothing but his own bank accounts.